IMPORTANT to new Sellers: change PP confirmed add preference

aspencounty · Posts: 815

I guess this has more to do with accepting credit cards payment through PayPal.

This is From PayPal:
"A confirmed address is an address that has been reviewed by PayPal and found to be safe based on information related to the address. For example, a credit card billing address is confirmed because PayPal can check that the address is the same as the address on file at the credit card company."

So if I want something shipped to my house at 1000 Any Street, Small Town USA and I'm using a credit card issued by my bank and they have the same address on file associated with the C/C then the two address match and PayPal sees this as a "confirmed" address.

Now if I move one house down the street to 1001 Any Street or move from apartment A to apartment B , then the addresses no longer match and PayPal see this as an unconfirmed address. If I want to ship something to my aunt living in another town then PayPal would see this as an unconfirmed address. If I want something shipped to the UPS Store (which provides a street address) instead of my house then they would see this as unconfirmed

If you ask me this is just a bunch of legal double talk to try and cover PayPal's backside. I guess it could work in a perfect world where no one ever moved or shipped anything to anyone but to themselves or never purchased a prepaid visa card for making online purchases.

cosmicray · Posts: 7286

OK, this is my take on the whole situation...

PayPal want to have a "reasonable defense" if a CC funded payment gets denied via a chargeback from the issuing bank. The issuing bank should have on file the address (or addresses) that the card holder has deemed as valid for shipping online purchases.

If you get a CC statement that contains a scam transaction, you call up the CC's fraud department and they investigate (and potentially reverse) the charge. Should the seller (me, you, all the EC sellers) present a tracking number, and that number can be entered and it reveals that the package was shipped to the C/A, then PP has grounds to tell the bank's fraud dept that it was legit and the cardholder is trying to scam the bank (or possibly forgot about the purchase). [ but see the last para below ]

In one of my posts above I mentioned that it is possible to have multiple C/A's on one PP account. That process would have to begin with the CC issuing entity (bank, etc) where the card holder would inform the CC issuer that they occasionally buy/send stuff to aunt Tilly, and this is her address. CC Issuer would enter that into their database. Then the card holder would go to PP and confirm that address (in addition to the primary one).

Where this all went out the window was with the other example I gave concerning the teacher in Georgia. Obstensibly, she had a C/A that was a bogus address as far as USPS was concerned. It is entirely possible that her active CC billing address was her home address, and she had a second C/A address added for her work address and no one checked to see if it was legit. So there ya go.

Exception to all of the above (has nothing to do with PP, but is about CC fraud)... Last year someone got into one of my CC numbers. The CC issuing bank called me up very quickly and asked about several charges (which I knew nothing about) and then locked the card promptly. When I got the statement with the four bogus charges, I noticed that one of them had an area-code that was not that far away, so I called and inquired about the transaction. They had my correct address on file. However, they had not shipped anything because it was backordered. mmmmkay. You charge someone for an unshipped item, but you have the correct address on file should the CC company. When I filled out the legal paper for the CC issuer indicating the charges were false, I made sure to point out that one of them had never shipped anything (nor had I ordered anything from them). So fraud works in my curious and varied ways.

aspencounty · Posts: 815

Very good points. I agree 100% that PayPal, banks and credit card companies are living in the dark ages and could certainly do more to prevent online theft and fraud.

I guess I'm lucky (knock on wood) but I have used PayPal for years with no problems. Personally I feel the PayPal policies are written for their protection and not necessarily for sellers. For me, trying to wade through all the rules and policies is overwhelming if not impossible....perhaps intentional Wink

collectiblyyours · Posts: 37

BT...anyone making a payment through PP can confirm their address. It is the address the credit card being used is billed to. Has nothing to do with them having a PP account, or being a "verified" buyer.

Of course, a few times we've had buyers who recently moved and didn't get around to changing their PP info. One package came back to us and buyer paid to re-ship. Another one we caught because phone number didn't match the area of the address. Whitepages.com sure comes in handy!

boomerang-records · Posts: 286

Thanks for all the input.

All of what is said here about confirmed PP address is correct - we must have it confirmed to use our PP card for any reason.

However, the problem with my ecrater PP transaction was that unconfirmed came up because buyer wanted to ship to another person And I think he put that person's address on the account for that purpose. [probably temporarily] so that person's shipping address is what caused a flag on the account [least I believe it did]

So what do we do when someone wants to send a gift???
PP needs to understand that it cannot chill the whole online gifting concept Rolling Eyes

aspencounty · Posts: 815

boomerang-records · Posts: 286

I apologize for not getting hold of PP and coming back with a solution....but all the posts seem to agree that a confirmed address is a requirement of PP.

One of the reasons this issue was important to me is that a friend wants to sell on ecrater

I said I would help her design her site -- but--- she want to sell"gifts" that will be paid by PP and sent directly to the giftee.
So now she said she will contact PP to figure it out. We'll see what happens.

IncredibleClutter · Posts: 164

Okay, I'll add to the confusion... Laughing

One of my recent eCRATER sales paid thru PayPal:
Customer had Confirmed address.
Customer was Not Verified.

On the details page: "(The sender of this payment is Unverified)"
Further down on the details page: "Seller Protection Policy: Ineligible"

Now, I've had unverified customers on eBay who had confirmed address and the SPP was stated as Eligible.

I think PayPal's UA has gotten so bloated, convoluted, and complicated that even they don't know what's what. In the end, it's all what the rep decides at that moment in time, depending on the mood they're in.

My settings allow unconfirmed, but I still state in my Terms that I'll only ship to confirmed. Just a CYA thing, in case someone seems risky.

wtcollectibles · Posts: 2728

Personally, I don't think PP even understands their confirming policy. I am a buyer as well, and I have a confirmed address. It's a PO box. I live in a small town a half-block from the post office; there is nary a mailbox in sight within 3 blocks. There was no home delivery in this town until about 10-12 years ago and most people have just stayed with their PO boxes.

Then I applied for a PP debit card. PP will not send a debit card to a PO box. I spent a couple of weeks trying to get my PP debit card. I had to present a credit card with my street address on it (not easy since there's no mail delivery--finally found my overdraft card which has both addresses on it!).

So I'm confirmed, but they themselves don't trust my confirmed address for a debit card! Evil or Very Mad

I just sent out an order to a buyer in Pleasant Lake or Pleasant Valley or the like, and her confirmed address read "Pleasnat". But when PP shipping connected to USPS, it wouldn't accept it. I change them all the time; I guess they are no longer confirmed, but they do get delivered.

I too ship whether it's confirmed or not, because I really don't think "confirmed" means much!! I use DC and insure everything through DSI and haven't had a loss since I started with the insurance. I ship internationally only to countries which are insurable. I had 2 $100+ losses to Germany before I started insuring; maybe it means nothing, but I have a sneaking suspicion that just knowing that the parcel is insured might slow down a potential cheater.

Sorry to wander off topic--back to the point--confirmed addresses with PP mean very little!

deerpathgallery · Posts: 234

boomerang-records · Posts: 286

One of my recent eCRATER sales paid thru PayPal:
Customer had Confirmed address.
Customer was Not Verified.

On the details page: "(The sender of this payment is Unverified)"
Further down on the details page: "Seller Protection Policy: Ineligible

OK - "not verified" doesn't have anything to do with "confirmed address" Here's why

The latest trend on the "bay" is to sever any connection with PP that allows access to your bank acct. My purpose of allowing PP access to my bank acct was strictly for automatic debit for fees.

However the infamous 21 day hold over there has caused a seismic earthquake of revolt - and people are disconnecting PP from their bank accts. [Supposedly in the event where seller withdrew funds "before" buyer requested a "charge-back" i.e not enough funds in PP acct. The thought was PP could debit your bank acct. for the charge-back ]

Recently, it is said over there - that PP can NEVER access your bank acct without your authorization - BUT - with automatic debit - it was sketchy whether PP could dip in for a 'chargeback'

So--- I recently cancelled my bank account status with PP - I received a reply that I was now unverified and no longer elegible for PP seller protection.

Being "verified" as I understand it means there is NO bank acct. to back up a PP transaction. Well there should not be any recourse by PP to EVER dip into a seller or buyer's acct anyway - except if authorized for debit of fees. But to be on the safe side, I cancelled it.

So I will NOT be concerned if a buyer is NOT verified - The only concern is an "unconfirmed" address and we can always choose to contact buyer to change it OR to confirm that it IS the address they want item shipped to, right??

IncredibleClutter · Posts: 164