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baystatejem
Posts: 110
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 Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 5:55 am Post subject: unfair google chargeback |
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on Feb 3, 2012, i received an order of an xbox game via google checkout, confirmed the order by email, shipped the game as promised.
on April 16, 2012, google checkout notified via email that the buyer claimed that this was unauthorized charge and demanded chargeback. google asked for information, and i provided the shipping info (usps receipt and email correspondence) immediately.
in two weeks, google emailed to say that i need to provide proof of delivery. i emailed to say that i do not buy delivery confirmation service and that proof of delivery is irrelevant to the "unauthorized purchase" claim by the cardholder.
i wanted to talk to a living person at google checkout, but there was no way to contact a person i could find via their website.
on May 6, google checkout team emailed me that they are charging $10 for fee on top of the chargeback, without the return of the game, because no valid proof of delivery was provided.
at this point, i do not want to use google checkout as a payment option. is it an option at ecrater? i would like an official response from ecrater. if it is not an option, i will close my ecrater stores. |
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RustyFarmall
Posts: 1300
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:04 am Post subject: |
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| Proof of delivery is your best friend. With USPS priority mail, delivery confirmation is free. |
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baystatejem
Posts: 110
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| the sellers better pray that the buyers don't know about this trick. oh wait, i have a hunch that they already do. |
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FoxAndFish
Posts: 1585
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 6:37 am Post subject: Re: unfair google chargeback |
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| baystatejem wrote: | | in two weeks, google emailed to say that i need to provide proof of delivery. i emailed to say that i do not buy delivery confirmation service and that proof of delivery is irrelevant to the "unauthorized purchase" claim by the cardholder. |
Proof of delivery is, however, relevant to Google's Payment Guarantee policy, which is relevant to their chargeback resolution policy, which is relevant to every GCO acct holder.
From "Payment Guarantee Policy" at http://support.google.com/checkout/sell/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=42863
"For transactions less than US$250, you must provide a tracking number or other proof of delivery with full shipping address.
For transactions of US$250 or more, you must provide proof of delivery with the buyer's signature and full shipping address."
| baystatejem wrote: | | i do not want to use google checkout as a payment option. is it an option at ecrater? |
Sellers need one electronic payment method to avoid uninvited Google ads in their stores. See the FAQ forum under "Google ads." Each seller has the option to choose which of the 2 supported electronic methods is desired or both.
| baystatejem wrote: | | i would like an official response from ecrater. |
Why do you need an official response from eCrater? If you don't want to use GCO, uncheck the option in your store. If you don't want to repeat this scenario with GCO again, incl Delivery Confirmation or Signature Confirmation for your shipments, as their policy states.
PayPal has a similar policy. From "Seller Protection" at https://cms.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/?cmd=_render-content&content_ID=security/seller_protection_learn_more; "For all transactions, keep proof of shipment and delivery that can be tracked online. If your buyer picks the item up in person, or you can't provide traceable proof of delivery, your transaction won't qualify." |
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baystatejem
Posts: 110
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 8:58 am Post subject: |
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i'm not sure if you are speaking for ecrater or not.
i simply wanted to confirm what ecrater policies are, so as not to unknowingly violate any of them.
so far, paypal has demonstrated a much more rational approach in their resolutions. so it's no brainer for me.
so, where do i go and what do i do, to drop google checkout as a payment option? help will be appreciated. i can't find the right place to accomplish that. |
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FoxAndFish
Posts: 1585
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| baystatejem wrote: | | i'm not sure if you are speaking for ecrater or not. |
I'm speaking for myself, as a seller.
| baystatejem wrote: | | i had the impression that ecrater was inextricably associated with google. |
I don't know on what basis you formed that impression so can't comment.
| baystatejem wrote: | | paypal has demonstrated a much more rational approach in their resolutions. |
Rational is in the eye of the beholder. Both GCO and PayPal have policies. Both GCO and PayPal expect acct holders to abide by their policies. And both are justified in enforcing their policies when a problem arises with an acct holder who did not abide by their policies. |
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cosmicray
Posts: 7286
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 9:37 am Post subject: Re: unfair google chargeback |
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| baystatejem wrote: | | in two weeks, google emailed to say that i need to provide proof of delivery. i emailed to say that i do not buy delivery confirmation service and that proof of delivery is irrelevant to the "unauthorized purchase" claim by the cardholder. |
If you are purchasing your postage electronically, Delivery Confirmation is now free for both Priority Mail and for First Class. I have a hard time understanding why you are not doing this (because it is in your best interest).
| Quote: | | so far, paypal has demonstrated a much more rational approach in their resolutions. so it's no brainer for me. |
Perhaps. The PayPal dispute resolution process is a bit less opaque than the GCO implementation, but PP will still want to see the Delivery Confirmation showing actual delivery. I do not believe that dropping GCO will protect you from this ever happening again. |
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baystatejem
Posts: 110
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 10:00 am Post subject: |
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i try not to have to deal with any impersonal big corporate structures, including shipping label companies, that serve themselves, neither the buyers nor the sellers.
when the right time comes, i will drop all big corporates of all levels, and deal with the buyers directly. it fits "the localization of all commerce" model that i like.
in the mean time, where can i find the link for dropping google checkout? |
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FoxAndFish
Posts: 1585
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| baystatejem wrote: | | i try not to have to deal with any impersonal big corporate structures |
And PayPal is not an "impersonal big corporate structure"?
| baystatejem wrote: | | including shipping label companies, that serve themselves, neither the buyers nor the sellers. |
The US Postal Service is not a shipping label company. It is a delivery service that serves both buyer and seller by transporting goods from seller to buyer. Delivery and Signature Confirmation services also serve both the seller and buyer, both of whom can track the location of the shipment.
Both PayPal and GCO require acct holders to have verification of shipment that can be tracked online.
| baystatejem wrote: | | where can i find the link for dropping google checkout? |
Same place it was when you signed up for GCO and PayPal: in the admin under Payment Options. |
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baystatejem
Posts: 110
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 10:42 am Post subject: |
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| thank you. just dropped google checkout. will drop paypal, too, in good time. |
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RustyFarmall
Posts: 1300
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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| baystatejem wrote: | | thank you. just dropped google checkout. will drop paypal, too, in good time. |
It's your store, so do as you wish, but when I am shopping on-line, and find a seller that does not accept instant credit card payments, I just hit the back button and move on.
Offering BOTH Google checkout AND Pay Pal is in your own best interest. I personally feel that the processing fees charged by both are a bit high, but without both of them I would do very little business. |
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TyreeTrading
Posts: 1608
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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One of the things the OP missed concerning proof of delivery...
If a seller can provide proof of delivery - to the cardholders address - then google could question the chargeback further.
Why? Because it means someone in the household received an item and didn't question the arrival of a strange package. An item that wasn't ordered by someone in the household and had no indication of being a gift. (which is a good reason to always include a packing slip) They didn't contact the seller (again a packing slip is essential) at the time of receipt. |
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MoonwishesStore
moderator
Posts: 17389
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | just dropped google checkout |
In that case you need to drop the reference to taking GCO from your about pages and terms page. You also need to remove the reference to taking credit cards on your own as ecrater is not set up that way and is, I believe, against eccrater rules.
You say you want to get rid of "all big corporates of all levels" then selling on ecrater isn't the place for you as you will have to use an electronic payment to make it worth your time trying to sell on line. Taking only money orders and checks will mean lots of folks bypassing what you have for sell as the other poster mentioned.
Shipping label companies are a blessed convenience for many of us. I know I don't have the time and gas money to drive to a PO daily and wait in line for the mailman to charge me and process my packages. Using electronic mail is cheaper in the long run than going to the PO.
PP and GCO have basically the same rules and you most likely would have won your case with GCO if you had paid for delivery confirmation This isn't a problem with GCO but with the way you run your business. If you had read the fine print when signing up for either payment plan, you would have known about charges for chargebacks. They weren't doing anything that you hadn't given them permission to do by agreeing to their terms. |
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thelivesandlovesofmaggiethecat
Posts: 10159
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Good luck selling on line if you don't accept online payment options. Here's hoping no one sends you a bogus MO or check. I trust PP and GCO any time over mailed payments that rarely show up.
Loss is a integral part of doing business whether you have a brick and mortar store and have breakage and theft or sell on line and have an occasional scam buyer or item that gets lost or broken in transit.
If you aren't currently investing in the stock market, I advise you not to because you are sure to back at least 50% losing stocks and you would probably develop ulcers over that. |
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MoonwishesStore
moderator
Posts: 17389
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2012 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | i would like an official response from ecrater. if it is not an option, i will close my ecrater stores. |
By the way, any time you want an official comment or response from ecrater, you need to write to them directly. This is the sellers forum where sellers talk to each other, not the place to look for official ecrater responses. |
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