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Does this site have fraud protection?

 
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NiftyGoods



Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:11 pm    Post subject: Does this site have fraud protection? Reply with quote

Since we can't track the buyer payment information to determine its validity, does this marketplace offer seller protection?
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MoonwishesStore



Posts: 16301

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps I am not understanding your question, but PP and Stripe process all the electronic payments. I know Stripe will refuse a payment if the credit card doesn't pass muster and I assume PP does the same. I have been selling here for around 9 years and never had a problem with payments whatsoever. I have been selling at other venues as well for close to 16 years now and never had a problem with the payments as in being defrauded.

Nor will I won't take personal checks, or MO (since the only ones that indicated they wanted to use a MO were international customers and my bank used to charge $8 just to cash a foreign MO don't have a clue what they charge now).

eCRATER does not, as far as I know, offer any seller protection. I guess I really don't understand what fraud prevention that you are worried about. Ecrater gives us a platform to sell on, but for the most part are pretty hands off otherwise unless the seller is defrauding buyers.
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SheilaDeesPostcards



Posts: 4061

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NiftyGoods wrote:
Since we can't track the buyer payment information to determine its validity, does this marketplace offer seller protection?
I'm not sure what you are seeking for "track the buyer payment information". You are currently only accepting PayPal and you can "track the buyer Payment information on PayPal" the same as any other site that uses PayPal. If the transaction qualifies for PayPal Seller Protection, then you would have that protection. The eCRATER site does not get involved with the payments between the buyer and seller, other than provide a checkout system that allows the buyer to make their payment via PayPal.

Maybe you could explain what type of 'tracking the buyer payment information" you are accustomed to having. If we understood what you have used in the past, we might could offer some suggestions.
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NiftyGoods



Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I ask because I received an international order that has me a little concerned. The cc used does not match the shipping address and they seem a little anxious for me to ship. If they used PayPal to place the order, I would feel better but they used stripe instead. If a payment were to get reversed, the decision would most likely be in favor or the cc holder and I would be at a loss. Is there a way to set up ecrater to make sure that shipping and billing address match?
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SheilaDeesPostcards



Posts: 4061

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I understand your concern. There is a way on eCRATER to make sure the buyer only ships to the billing address when they use Stripe. In your admin. go to Account: > Options and put a check in the box marked "Ship to billing address only (for Stripe orders)". This doesn't work for PayPal, but will stop the problem for future orders with Stripe.

The customer could be a little anxious because it's a Christmas present and they want to make sure it arrives on time. Then again, your instinct may be correct and there is a problem. You could try explaining to the customer that you only ship to the billing address for international orders and offer them the choice of using the billing address or a cancellation of the order with a full refund.

If the country is one with tracking available through USPS, be sure to use tracking for your protection. You will need to use online electronic postage and here's the link to the info on the USPS site: https://pe.usps.com/text/imm/immc2_022.htm?q=E-USPS+Delcon+Intl&t=H&s=R&p=1&c=IMM.
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NiftyGoods



Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you very much for your input. I appreciate your response and your assistance on my issue. I will make the necessary changes on my account. Thanks again
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cosmicray



Posts: 6951

PostPosted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SheilaDeesPostcards wrote:
Now I understand your concern. There is a way on eCRATER to make sure the buyer only ships to the billing address when they use Stripe. In your admin. go to Account: > Options and put a check in the box marked "Ship to billing address only (for Stripe orders)". This doesn't work for PayPal, but will stop the problem for future orders with Stripe.

To be fair, and to add another twist to this discussion … some Euro charge/debit cards do not emit address information to Stripe[1]. Stripe's default behavior (for those cards) is to check the CVC/CVV code, then mark the zip and street as "Unchecked". It doesn't refuse the payment (assuming it passes the CVC/CVV), it just merrily sends it along and tell you what country the card belongs to. No address check/match of any kind.

I had such an order come in about 3 weeks ago, with a Germany card. Shipping address was to somewhere near Boston. As I had very little (if any) confidence in the transaction, I refunded the payment and told the buyer why I did so. The buyer was not particularly happy. Checking the Stripe log, I could see that they had tried a different card just before the one that went thru. The first attempt was refused for Insufficient Funds. Another indicator.

About a week after that, they popped up on another site I sell on, and placed an order for the same item. I mentioned to them that the same card would not work there, as I only accept PayPal and I block all non-US payments. We finally agreed that they would send me a USPS money order instead. That was back on the 10th. As of the 22nd, no MO has been received. I'm going to give it a couple more days, then dump that order as well. When I placed the order in per-cancellation status, the buyer didn't even react (as I would have expected had the MO been in transit). We shall see, but it bodes poorly for the validity of the original payment attempt via Stripe.

Note that the particular LEGO set in question is very difficult to find, and I have only found one other seller (oddly in Germany) with it on offer.

[1] Either because of cross-border privacy laws, or possibly because the card is an anonymous cash card.
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MoonwishesStore



Posts: 16301

PostPosted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To add yet another twist, I get international orders via Stripe and they don't always have an address match and to be perfectly honest, most of the time I don't even look to see if it passed every check. If Stripe takes the payment (and I have seen evidence that they don't take every card submitted) and charges me a fee, I ship. I haven't had a trouble, but I do sell in a niche that isn't fertile ground for scammers. I've taken in over $8000 in Stripe orders. May not be as much as some, but no problems with Stripe.
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NiftyGoods



Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your story. The information you provided was a big help. The order I received had the address as unchecked and I asked the buyer for the name, address, and phone number of the card used. The info the sent me doesn't match the shipping address and I tried to verify the information but was unsuccessful. I thought stripe would have canceled the order if the criteria wasn't met, but now that you have explained, I can see why the order went through. I will cancel the order and notify my buyer. Thanks again. You saved me.
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cosmicray



Posts: 6951

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NiftyGoods wrote:
Thank you for your story. The information you provided was a big help. The order I received had the address as unchecked and I asked the buyer for the name, address, and phone number of the card used. The info the sent me doesn't match the shipping address and I tried to verify the information but was unsuccessful. I thought stripe would have canceled the order if the criteria wasn't met, but now that you have explained, I can see why the order went through. I will cancel the order and notify my buyer. Thanks again. You saved me.

Generally speaking, Stripe does not yank payments back once they have approved them. I think there was one payment where they suggested there may be a problem (due to elevated risk) while I was processing.

Stripe only does the address and zip checks, when they have information on both sides to compare. When they do not, they don't assign any additional risk, but just let it fly. That seems counter-intuitive, but I guess the theory is that people selling digital goods could be impacted.
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NiftyGoods



Posts: 5

PostPosted: Sat Nov 25, 2017 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you again for the informative response. You have given me a lot to consider.
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welding



Posts: 24

PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I opened my store to international sales this year, and have gotten a handful of orders from the UK (but that's it).
I take Paypal but not Stripe.
Is Stripe more widely held by buyers outside the US? In other words, am I likely missing out on international orders because I only take PP?

For those of you with significant international sales, what payment method do your non-US buyers use?
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MoonwishesStore



Posts: 16301

PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To correct one thing, Stripe is not 'widely held' as in it being a credit card. Stripe is only a merchant payments processor. They do not issue cards or anything else. They will process payments for I believe the 4 major credit card systems.

I generally get about as many Stripe orders as PP. Sometimes in one month one or the other may have more payments for that month and then it flips back. I get international payments through both PP and Stripe. One of the big reasons I take both systems is some buyer and or sellers absolutely will have nothing to do with PP. It gives them a choice that in a B&M store they have no choice about. In a B&M store, you can decide which card to use, just like here, but you don't get to pick your payment processor like you can here. If you go to the mall and shop and buys things in 4-6 stores using the same cc each time. The stores may each use a different payment processor. You never know who it is. As long as the card is confirmed the store will hand you your bag of merchandise. Probably why I'm a bit more laid back about using Stripe and/or PP. I've never had a bit of trouble with either Stripe or PP. At this point over $8500 in payments via Stripe. I got an order from NZ today through PP. I've had other international orders through Stripe. I'm not even sure why a customer gets any sort of choice of which payment processor to go through. That is usually just an arrangement between the merchant and processor and the buyer has no choice in the matter.

My international orders come in via both ways. Neither one stands out. I remember one from Norway was through Stripe. Currently I'm on my laptop which doesn't have my sales records so I can't see if I get more from one or the other.

As I have mentioned before, I have non-scam (for the most part) merchandise, so I don't bother spending time worrying about whether something has passed the address check or not. If they have taken a fee out of the payment, then I ship. I do not nor would I try to track down why an address doesn't pass unless I was selling something of high value and it didn't pass the address check, maybe.
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cosmicray



Posts: 6951

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

welding wrote:
Is Stripe more widely held by buyers outside the US? In other words, am I likely missing out on international orders because I only take PP?

Stripe is not a branded card. Stripe is a merchant card processor.

PayPal is also a merchant card processor, plus PayPal can convey payments thru it's classic mechanisms. PP's merchant card payments are called 'Express' IIRC.
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